Max sat and stared out the window for what seemed to be an eternity but was only a mere few seconds, before turning to Charlie.
He looked at Charlie in utter disbelief and in a soft voice asked him, "Have you ever made anyone crazy?"
Charlie appeared stunned and stuttered in disbelief, searching for words that escaped him. I answered for him and told Max that he had made his first two wives crazy.
Max then proceeded to speak to Charlie, stating that he had already seen first hand the impact of his lies, and yet here he was continuing with the same pattern of behaviour.
Max asked him where he got off in believing that he had the right to retraumatize me with his constant deceit and manipulative behaviours. He also stated that there was no wonder that I was where I was and that he did not know how I managed to stay in the relationship for as long as I had and could not believe I had any energy whatsoever with regard to my marriage.
Charlie, as usual, tried to justify his behaviour.
Firstly Max addressed the call Charlie made to his mother from his mobile.
"So you made an agreement not to call your mother from your mobile and yet you called your mother from your mobile?" asked Max.
"Yes but...." Charlie began.
"No. You had an agreement with your wife not to call your mother from your mobile, and you called her from your mobile?" asked Max.
He then addressed the traffic infringement Charlie received and failed to tell me about it.
"You didn't tell her about the fine?"
Charlie stated that he "told me about it", but Max shut him down stating that it was 3 days later.
"You should have accepted the fine and whilst pulled over called her and told her immediately, none of this hiding it for 3 days!"
Max then addressed the day that Charlie came home early to jump into bed for a cuddle before going to the meeting that he failed to tell me about.
Charlie tried to justify his behaviour because I get so angry about these sort of things, but Max would not hear of it.
Max pointed out to Charlie what he did was pre-meditated, that it hadn't just happened as Charlie tried to make Max believe, but he had planned it with the view to 'buttering me up' before letting me down again. He pointed out to Charlie how manipulative his behaviour truly was and that I had a right to be angry when his manipulative behaviour was discovered.
Charlie once again tried to justify his behaviour and shift the blame to me, telling Max about the recent event where out of pure frustration I hit him.
I am not proud of this incident, not at all. I deeply regret hitting Charlie because nothing justifies domestic violence.......NOTHING. But yes I hit him.
"So you're telling me that this is a domestic violence situation. Correct?" asked Max.
Charlie again stuttered.
I responded. "Yes it is. I hit him. It is a domestic violence situation."
What happened next shocked me.
Max turned to Charlie and said "If this is a violent situation, and you know what sets the violence off, then why do you continue to behave in a way that is sure to inspire a violent reaction?"
Charlie sat and stared at Max sitting in his winged chair across from him, and Max stared back.
"You are the provoker. You are to blame. You continue to lie and use manipulative behaviour to get what you want. You bring the violent outbursts on with your own behaviour."
I couldn't believe what I had just heard. I am responsible for hitting Charlie, but here was a highly regarded relationship coach telling me it was not my fault and that I was indeed provoked. It still does not justify hitting Charlie because no person in ANY relationship should be subjected to violence of any nature, but I felt a sense of relief wash over me, taking with it alot of the guilt I had been carrying.
I sat there in stunned silence. I can't really remember the words that were then spoken between Max and Charlie, because my mind was swimming with my own thoughts.
When I finally came back to reality I tuned in to the conversation and heard Charlie trying to make himself look good again, making statements like "I'm as transparent as I've ever been".
Charlie turned to me and said something. I can't remember what it was but I can certainly remember my reaction to it.
"Until you take responsibility for your actions and your behaviours, then nothing will ever be fixed. Until you take full responsibility for your actions and your behaviours, then nothing will ever change. And I am not at all interested in staying in a marriage that is constant lies and manipulation."
Max said to me "I am glad you said that because at no stage during this appointment have I seen any responsibility taken."
I walked out of that appointment feeling so different to how I felt when I walked in.
I felt amazing.
I felt like a huge weight had lifted from my shoulders.
I felt free.
I felt listened to.
But most of all I finally felt HEARD.
Thursday, May 3, 2007
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20 comments:
Honey, I feel for you...I think its a positive thing that you're going to see a therapist who tells you things as he sees fit. None of this may matter to Charlie, who will continue to behave as he wishes, but perhaps having someone point this out to him will help. And it will definitely help you sort your thoughts out!
I think too often, women end up arguing with themselves, because they're so desperate to be fair to their partners...I don't think men have this problem.
I know my guy doesn't.
I hope Max get's through to him I'm glad you had this positive experience, I can tell by what you wrote that weight has been lifted from you!
Can I just say that I love your therapist???
It means a lot to have someone else say all the things you've already said to your husband. While Charlie is in his foggy state where he can't seem to hear you, he needs to hear it from someone else. Hopefully it'll bring him to the point where he can hear *you* the first time.
Does it not feel great to feel that you have been heard? I am so very happy for you. I would give you a big hug if I were there.
Hi guys,
Nalini - you are spot on correct with the difference between men and women. I think this is the main reason I have stayed around because 'he says he gets it so he deserves another chance to prove it".
Weekends - I don't think I have ver stood so tall! A HUGE weight has been lifted from my shoulders. And it appears Max has gotten through to him.
Naive - my therapist is worth triple his weight in gold! He just seems to be able to point things out so clearly to Chalrlie, where there is no room for blame shifting and the only way to go is accept responsibility.
Karin - I cannot begin to describe my feelings after I left that appointment. I was HEARD! I WASN"T crazy!
It was AMAZING!!!!!
Hip hip hooray is all I can say!Well, not quite... I think the reason the therapist validated around the hitting is because he did not want to get sidetracked. Ever hear the term cakewalker?
I agree 110% with everything Nalini mentioned.
I'm glad that you feel this way, Kate. It sure gets a lot of the inner frustrations out.
I don't know, once I found out my husband cheated on me, I became overwhelmed with negative emotions, but its' funny how not his parents, nor my stbx husband attributed these feelings to my husband's behavior. They said something along the lines like, "Well, the way that she's reacting to these problems is in HER character". (I too hit my husband on the last day we lived together, on one night after I got tired of waiting for him to come home and he finally showed up at 3am because of course, he was with you know who. Anyway, that night, he came home and left right away - I never saw him again and it's been 1 year now.
I don't believe that my or your character had anything to do with the hitting behavior. I strongly believe that people - especially those who we love and care about, can take out the worst - and best in us.
Finally, I wish I had that - I wish my husband (ex to be) can listen to a therapist tell him what he's done to drive me 1/2 insane. I would also feel as if a weight were to be lifted.
Kate, God bless ya!
It's too easy for someone to paint us with the crazy brush to justify their own behaviour, until they meet Max ;-)
Everyone needs a Max
It's an amazing feeling, when you suddenly realise you haven't been going crazy. I'm glad you've had that Kate. Thing is, making someone face up to what they're doing, when they actually already know exactly what they're doing, won't change anything. He may have been 'outed' but can he change? The cunning ones learn to play within the new parameters.
I wonder if he will continue to just try to drizzle syrup over everything and think you are taken by the sweetness? The cherry desert was wonderful but only sustained truth and honesty will demonstrate a real change. Let's see if he's up to it.
Wow. Didnt you just want to stand up and look at Charlie, stick your tongue out at him and say, "I told you so! I told you so!"
:)
Fiona I am also hesitant because he has made changes so many times over the years once he told me he 'got it' only to once again let me down.
We'll see what happens but I am still not jumping in boots and all.
Kris - I would have loved to have given him the finger whilst sticking my tongue out! But don't worry, I did say to him once we left about the appointment not being what he expected.
Kate, you are blessed to have Max, who tells it like it is!!!!!!!
I'm glad you're feeling less burdened. What Charlie has been putting you through disgusts me.
However, hitting someone you love is NEVER justified (no matter how much Charlie deserved it). What if the roles were reversed? What if Max had said, "Well, Kate, you know that if you burnt the toast again, Charlie would hit you, so why did you burn it again?" It sounds like nonsense to me.
's', I think Kate is well aware that hitting is not acceptable behavior. Max knows that also, I am sure. Max is obviously trying to get thru to Charlie. I think he is doing a damn good job. Max seems to be working hard to get Charlie past his behavior. Kate has accepted her responsibility. Now it is time for Charlie to.
s* I am certainly not proud of hitting Charlie as I clearly state in my post.
This is NOT a frequent occurence, and certainly NOT something that occured over burnt toast.
Burnt toast is not a deep traumatic betrayal.
littlewing...thanks. And I totally agree that Max is doing a brilliant job!
I think some peeple need a good slapping, spesh today with the morons i have to deal with
LOL.....I agree, Laura, some people just beg to be bitch-slapped!
Clearly, you know that i know that what Charlie has done to you doesn't compare to burnt toast. Come on, Kate!
As someone who was physically abused, I don't like to see it justifed by either party, either sex, for any reason whatsoever.
And it doesn't matter that I secretly think Charlie needs a kick in the ass.
I have to agree with Max on the being provoked. That doesn't justify hitting, but I do believe that for every action there is a reaction, and sometimes the reaction is very difficult to control. I believe this is how a lot of domestic violence gets started. I have known men who almost begged a woman to hit them. Most men are bigger and stronger and we know who is going to win.
S is correct in saying that domestic violence is not the answer. It never is. But sometimes we just reach a point of no return.
If Charlie was my husband I would have probably done worse than hitting him. I know how Lorrena Bobbit felt. I understand completely what kind of outrage led her to do what she did. Not justifying what she did but......just saying......
I always found letting all 4 tyres down a most satisfying alternative :-)
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